Friday, June 13, 2008

Absurd Ruling

Can someone please tell me where in the US Constitution it says that non-US citizens who were captured trying to KILL actual US citizens on foreign soil have the same rights as US citizens? Well according to the US Supreme Court's activists liberals and moderate, now they do by having access to US courts for appeals of the military tribunals at Gitmo.

Judge Scalia nails it with this quote in his dissenting opinion,"Today's decision will almost certainly cause more Americans to be killed."

This should be red meat for the Republican Presidential nominee. However, while McCain said it was a bad decision and Obama praised it, McCain's position on Gitmo being shut down takes away much of the strength of the issue for him.

This issue once again highlights the importance of this coming election. Many expect the next President to appoint one, possibly two new Supremes. While I'm only about 60% confident in that McCain will pick a strict constructionist, I'm 100% confident that such a judge will not even be considered by Obama. Another reason to hold my nose while voting for McCain b/c we are only one judge away from having a Supreme Court that follows the US Constitution and not legislate from the bench.

Also blogging on topic:
Little Miss Chatterbox


Dee said...

The whole thing is so depressing. The only glimmer of hope is that you knew Scalia was bursting a blood vessel over the whole thing ;-).

And what makes it even more depressing is, once again McCain is on the wrong side of this issue once again. Politically speaking hope for conservatives is extremely dismal at this stage of the game.

Ron said...

Another example of why lawyers have bad reputations.

This is a HUGE setback on the war on terror.

The leftist southpaw said...


never said that before...

Cajun Tiger said...

So we are to praise people who completely ignore the Constitution and make our soldiers less safe? And here I thought you supported the troops Southpaw?

These thugs are not even afforded Geneva convention rights, yet we give them and now thanks to this absolutely insane ruling they will also receive US rights which is more than even the Germans or Japanese received in WWII and they did have Geneva rights.

shannon w kirkpatrick said...

when an American kills someone (or many), he still has legal rights of due process, because we here in the US believe that all humans deserve some protection, even those accused of wrongdoing (innocent until proven guilty).

and yet for some reason, because someone who was not born in our land, and who has a different religion or different governmental opinions than we do, kills others, we decide they don't have those same rights.

are they less human than us? do they deserve less mercy than us? can we safely assume they are guilty without being proven guilty in a court of law?

why do the accusations of their killing not need to be proven in a court of law when an American accused of killing has those rights?

why do we who profess a love for freedom and protection and rights but not respect the freedom, protection and rights of those not born in our country?

I'm not in ANY way condoning acts of terrorism, just as I in no way condone any murdering in our country. I just believe that if we are to be consistent, if we give legal rights to accused criminals here, we should give legal rights to any criminal.

Just because they are foreign does not mean they are less human or don't deserve the same protections. Thus the dangers of nationalism pride taken to a frenzy.

God forgives all humans equally who sincerely desire to repent. And we've heard numerous stories of men and women in prison seeing the error of their ways and repenting and becoming a contributor to society rather than a detriment (thank you Chuck Colson for your patience and good work). Yes the percentages are extremely small, but isn't a little grace worth it?

If we have the chance, no matter how slim, to help someone see the error of their ways and show them the Truth and Peace that come with Christ, shouldn't we leap on that chance? God has forgiven each of us our many mistakes (some of them serious, for myself included), and I don't want to turn around and judge someone else prematurely, right after Christ has been patient and forgiving with me.

And so if there is a chance that an alleged terrorist is innocent, then I would like to see him get his name cleared in a court of law. And if there is a chance that a true terrorist could repent of his ways and spend an eternity with me in Heaven, both of us grateful for God's Love and Mercy, then I want to give that terrorist a chance. I will still hate the evil of terrorism, but I will give every chance I can to forgive a repentant evildoer.

I hear all the time how we are to submit to our authorities, but too often the underlying thought is 'if we agree with them' or 'if they are in our party'. If my government directly disobeys Scripture, I must resist that decision. But if it is not a direct disobedience of Scripture, then I must submit to it, whether I personally agree with it or not.

So I submit to my leaders in the Supreme Court and their decision to give legal rights to accused terrorists.

And I pray that these legal rights will 1) clear the names of innocents accused and 2) provide opportunity for the guilty to repent of their evil ways.

And I will continue to pray for the hearts of terrorists to be softened, to see the peace in Jesus.

And I will pray for my fellow American soldiers to have wisdom in this war, and that God encourage and edify them in their pursuit of Biblical justice.

And I pray for those Americans who have hatred for terrorists, that they may separate the evil actions (which we must never condone) from the person, who is obviously hurting and lost in darkness. And I pray for a change of heart for those hateful Americans, that they may see the biggest priority of all is that God is worshiped as people come to submit to Him and His Son, not the protection of some piece of land. Again, I am not condoning the killing of innocents or mass murder, but I see an individual's salvation of utmost importance. So instead of praying for a person's destruction, I will pray for their repentance and salvation. That is my priority, a priority that comes from my study of Scriptures and the tough balance of Justice and Mercy that my King Jesus lives out.

The War on Satan is more subtle, more eternally deadly and more serious than the War on Terror. I am NOT saying that we shouldn't fight the War on Terror. I AM saying that the War on Satan surrounds the War on Terror and we must not forget it.

Christ has chosen to forgive ALL my sins and mistakes in life, and there were many people praying that I repent and cling to Him. And so I will do the same for everyone else. I will pray that all come to repentance and that all have a change of heart and that all submit to Christ and peace. And I truly hope the streets of Heaven are crowded indeed.

But for those who do not repent, for those who chose evil over godliness, who chose their own idols and kings over Christ, an eternal judgment awaits them, and I pity the spiritual retribution they bring on themselves.

Cajun Tiger said...

Shannon...they are getting a trial. They are allowed to present their case. They have the same rights, even though by international law they aren't afforded them, that Germans and Japanese got after WWII in the military tribunals.

Being they aren't US citizens they aren't governed by US law, they are covered by international law. International law says when in war, prisoners of war, are treated humanely and given a trial AFTER the war is over. But it also defines POW as someone in uniform for a recognized nation which these prisoners don't fall under either. However, the US has still decided to treat them by those rules so they are going above and beyond what the law requires.

What the court decision now does is take it even further which puts more people in danger b/c now classified information may have to be declassified in order to convict. That info could be used to prevent capture next time and it also ties the hands of the military in many ways.

So while I never said the ruling shouldn't be followed b/c they are the final decision until it is overturned, it is a very bad decision that goes against international law and against US law.

shannon w kirkpatrick said...

that's good to know that they are getting a trial. tough that it comes *after* the war, since the War on Terror isn't a typical war and will probably go on a LONG time.

(and still doesn't justify waterboarding and other inhumane techniques.)

what are your thoughts on the balance of God's Justice and God's Mercy and where we fit into that?

Ron said...


Waterboarding is most definitly humane, justified and appropriate when it comes to obtaining important information from KNOWN terrorist leaders that could save thousands of lives.

I question that you fully understand the concept of Evil? God's Justice is confronting Evil where ever it may be found. His Mercy is our right to defend that which is righteous and sacred to us...(meaning you and your families existance), without being judged.

Our land has been unjustly attacked by people who hate us because of our Christian roots and our support for Israel's exsistance.

Until you and others like you understand Evil, you will never understand God's justice our mercy.

shannon w kirkpatrick said...

sir, respectfully,

the Merriam-Webster definition of 'humane' is: "marked by compassion, sympathy, or consideration for humans or animals". I really cannot see how waterboarding someone shows them compassion.

and mercy is NOT our right to defend ourselves. Mercy is forgiving our wrongdoings. The Merriam Webster definition of mercy is: "compassion or forbearance shown especially to an offender or to one subject to one's power; also : lenient or compassionate treatment b: imprisonment rather than death imposed as penalty for first-degree murder"

God has forgiven me my wrongdoings and I appreciate that tremendously. And so I pray that evil men of terror find Jesus and repent of their evil deeds.

again, there is a balance between God's Justice and God's Mercy, and I am trying to find what exactly it means to hate evil and forgive those who commit evil against me. I'm not there yet, but I am seeking Biblical guidance on that matter and how to apply it to the reality of life.

Cajun Tiger said...

By Geneva conventions the trials don't have to happen until after the war, but we are having them now. 100s have already been released, some of which have returned to the battle field and have been arrested a second time or were suicide bombers.

The balance is they are getting a trial, justice, even though they aren't even afforded those rights by international law, mercy.

shannon w kirkpatrick said...

well said Shane! thanks for pointing that out.